Dake Bible Discussion BoardGod's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

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victoryword
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God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by victoryword »

According to Dake:
  • b God is responsible for disease only in the sense of making the law of sowing and reaping (Gal. 6:7-8); making penalties for sin (Ex. 15:26; 23:22-25; Lev. 26; Dt. 28); and permitting agencies with the power to execute the curse on man to have their way (Job 1:6-22; 2:1-13; 42:10; Ps. 91; Lk. 13:16; Jn. 10:10; Acts 10:38; Heb. 2:14-15; Rev. 9:1-12). If there had been no sin there would be no curse. When Christ reigns on earth there will be no sickness (Isa. 33:24; 35:5-6). When God's will is done on earth as in heaven, there will be no curse (Rev. 21:1 -- Rev. 22:6).
    Dake's Annotated Reference Bible.


Kenneth Hagin (and many other faith teachers) often point to Robert Young's "Hints and helps to Bible Interpretation" to affirm that the Old Testament Hebrew supports this. I have found a Young's Concordance online that contains this section:
http://www.archive.org/stream/analytica ... 1/mode/2up

I fully agree with Dake (and Hagin). What are the thoughts on this forum? Do you guys believe that God takes an active role in sickness or is it passive (permissive).



victoryword
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by victoryword »

Dolph, would you say that Satan is enforcing God's laws? Not sure if I could agree with the statement as it stands. Satan is at war with God and hates God. And I never saw God using Satan as some tool.

I would say that Satan looks for an opportunity to devour us (1 Pet. 5:8-9) and we give him that opportunity when we sin (Eph. 4:27). Our persistence in sin removes us from God's umbrella of protection and places us where Satan has a legal right to inflict us.



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macca
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by macca »

victoryword wrote:According to Dake:
  • b God is responsible for disease only in the sense of making the law of sowing and reaping (Gal. 6:7-8); making penalties for sin (Ex. 15:26; 23:22-25; Lev. 26; Dt. 28); and permitting agencies with the power to execute the curse on man to have their way (Job 1:6-22; 2:1-13; 42:10; Ps. 91; Lk. 13:16; Jn. 10:10; Acts 10:38; Heb. 2:14-15; Rev. 9:1-12). If there had been no sin there would be no curse. When Christ reigns on earth there will be no sickness (Isa. 33:24; 35:5-6). When God's will is done on earth as in heaven, there will be no curse (Rev. 21:1 -- Rev. 22:6).
    Dake's Annotated Reference Bible.


Kenneth Hagin (and many other faith teachers) often point to Robert Young's "Hints and helps to Bible Interpretation" to affirm that the Old Testament Hebrew supports this. I have found a Young's Concordance online that contains this section:
http://www.archive.org/stream/analytica ... 1/mode/2up

I fully agree with Dake (and Hagin). What are the thoughts on this forum? Do you guys believe that God takes an active role in sickness or is it passive (permissive).




:angel: yes fully agree
macca



victoryword
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

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macca wrote: :angel: yes fully agree
macca
Thanks Macca



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macca
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by macca »

I use the Young's Analytical Concordance most of the time in study.

macca



victoryword
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by victoryword »

dolph wrote:VW, I said "indirectly" enforcing. I would say that Satan and his demons serve a useful purpose in God's plan for man, otherwise why didn't God throw him in the pit 2,000 years ago? A parallel might be how Hell gives a person a little added persuasion to be saved or to be good even though it was designed for the rebellious angels.
I know you said "indirectly" but I still have an issue with it, however, nothing to divide over.

However, an alternative and BIblical understanding as to why God has not yet permanently dealt with Satan could be due to the slanderous charges that he launched against God. Notice how he slanders God in Gen. 3 accusing God of selfishness, lying, and stingy. NO doubt he used that same tactic with the angels, thereby causing a third of them to follow him and possibly leaving some questions in the minds of some of the faithful angels.

In Job 1, right in front of the counsel of angels Satan again is trying to slander God by accusing Him of bribing Job to get his worship, attempting to persuade the counsel that God is not doing anything by agape love, but through selfish political bribery. Therefore, instead of crushing Satan like an ant as He could have easily done, God, for the sake of the rest of the universe, allows Satan to prove his case by letting him attack Job.

God is allowing Satan the freedom to prove his case against God and allowing the universe - men and angels - to see him for what he truly is. Rev. 12 says that his time is short.

I have a whole teaching outline I have done on this with all my Bible proofs if you want a copy of it. Just e-mail me at victoriousword@gmail.com

I would also recommend purchasing a book titled “The Salvation of Angels” by Pastor Michael A. Wiley. Wiley is a pastor of a Charismtic church.



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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by Ironman »

"I fully agree with Dake (and Hagin). What are the thoughts on this forum? Do you guys believe that God takes an active role in sickness or is it passive (permissive)."
.

God is not the author of sin, sickness, nor confusion. "For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints" (1 Cor. 14:33).

"And ye shall serve the LORD your God, and he shall bless thy bread, and thy water; and I will take sickness away from the midst of thee." (Ex. 23:25).

"And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people." (Matt. 4:23; 9:35).


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

victoryword
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

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Ironman wrote:
"I fully agree with Dake (and Hagin). What are the thoughts on this forum? Do you guys believe that God takes an active role in sickness or is it passive (permissive)."
.

God is not the author of sin, sickness, nor confusion. "For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints" (1 Cor. 14:33).

"And ye shall serve the LORD your God, and he shall bless thy bread, and thy water; and I will take sickness away from the midst of thee." (Ex. 23:25).

"And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people." (Matt. 4:23; 9:35).
All of these are true. However, I struggled for a long time with the Old Testament (and even some New Testament) passages that made it appear as if God inflicted sickness. It was not until I began to thoroughly study out the idea that many of these passages are permissive rather than causative that I began to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that it is not the God of love that I know whoever inflicts people with anything hurtful.



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macca
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by macca »

victoryword wrote:
Ironman wrote:
"I fully agree with Dake (and Hagin). What are the thoughts on this forum? Do you guys believe that God takes an active role in sickness or is it passive (permissive)."
.

God is not the author of sin, sickness, nor confusion. "For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints" (1 Cor. 14:33).

"And ye shall serve the LORD your God, and he shall bless thy bread, and thy water; and I will take sickness away from the midst of thee." (Ex. 23:25).

"And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people." (Matt. 4:23; 9:35).
All of these are true. However, I struggled for a long time with the Old Testament (and even some New Testament) passages that made it appear as if God inflicted sickness. It was not until I began to thoroughly study out the idea that many of these passages are permissive rather than causative that I began to know beyond a shadow of a doubt that it is not the God of love that I know whoever inflicts people with anything hurtful.


I think you just made some Baptists mad... :mrgreen:



victoryword
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Re: God's role in sickness - Permissive or Causative

Post by victoryword »

macca wrote: I think you just made some Baptists mad... :mrgreen:
I certainly hope so :2gunfire:



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